Howdy,
I am a fairly good breeder with freshwater fish, but a total n00b with saltwater. I want to get a small tank with some banggai cardinalfish . . . for breeding of course 
I am aiming for a small amount of live rock, live sand, lots of macro algae . . . basically a refuge of a tank.
My question is, what’s the most basic/simple that I can get away with?
cheers,
wm_crash, the friendly hooligan
[quote=“wm_crash, post:1, topic:1457”]
My question is, what’s the most basic/simple that I can get away with?[/quote]
Hi, and :Welcome)
It really depends on how much maintenance you want to be doing on your tank. You can set up a tank with no filtration, only live rock and macro, and be successful. You will have to be very regimined with your water changes, but it may work if you keep the fish load very low. Add a skimmer and things get easier. It’s all about how much work you want to have to do. Also, consider a larger tank if you are new, your levels will take longer to stray in a larger system.
Welcome to DRC! Glad you joined us.
To answer your question:
[quote=“wm_crash, post:1, topic:1457”]
My question is, what’s the most basic/simple that I can get away with?[/quote]
I first have to ask, do you want this tank to be pretty or do you intend it to be a breeding tank? If this is going to be a tank for breeding, and not one for display, then the setup is quite different. If you want to go with a “Display Refugium” type of tank and try to breed them as well, the tank will look much different.
A breeding tank is not necessarily a pretty tank. A tank full of live rock and hair algae might not be the nicest looking tank, but it wont need much in the line of water changes since the algae would use up the nutrients before they could harm the fish and it would also provide a place for live foods to grow on their own. Would it be pretty? No. It would be efficient though and would work to raise the fry just as well as systems with the most expensive filtration, but you probably wouldn’t want it in the middle of your living room.
Howdy,
I am not going for pretty at all. It’s a basement project. I am more fond of macro algae than hair algae, but I won’t let that ruin breeding. Even as of now, my freshwater breeding tanks look cosmetically awfull . . . . I occasionally use an ice scraper to get the algae off the tank glass. However the fish are tip-top shape.
The closest fish store has 6 cardinalfish. Say I wanted to get those . . . what would be the suggestions as far as breeding setup? Say like a 30G, sand, liverock, macroalgae, sponge filter, heater, . . . lights . . . flourescent works or needs more fancy than that?
cheers,
wm_crash, the friendly hooligan
i have one banggia and am buying one too two more for my 90 reef. i have researched some and seem to be a good canadite for breeding. they are mouth breeders and usually fry is sucessful after release. so i will keep in touch with you as far as breeding goes. also to answer your questions i would say any light would work due to just fish and algea. i would use a heater for the size tank you determine on. even a cheap hob filter is a good chioce for this set up. you will have to give some time for tank to cycle before you add fish though.
It could be identical to your freshwater setups only add Salt. Pretty is not needed for breading. PM Kaptken as he has bread cardinals before.
When you buy them it is hard to tell the sex apart but I think ken would be able to chime in best. Their tail shape when mature shows their sex. I think Ken mentioned they are best in small groups of about 3
[quote=“wm_crash, post:4, topic:1457”]
Howdy,
I am not going for pretty at all. It’s a basement project. I am more fond of macro algae than hair algae, but I won’t let that ruin breeding. Even as of now, my freshwater breeding tanks look cosmetically awfull . . . . I occasionally use an ice scraper to get the algae off the tank glass. However the fish are tip-top shape.
The closest fish store has 6 cardinalfish. Say I wanted to get those . . . what would be the suggestions as far as breeding setup? Say like a 30G, sand, liverock, macroalgae, sponge filter, heater, . . . lights . . . flourescent works or needs more fancy than that?
cheers,
wm_crash, the friendly hooligan[/quote]
If you like the look of macro algaes, I would suggest using them as filtration. For a breeding pair, I would reccomend probably a 20g tank, with about 20lbs of Live Rock (LR). Sand is optional, but some macro algaes do better with it so I would at least put in a shallow sand bed. Other than that, all you would need is a heater, a decent powerhead for water movement, and some florescent lights. For the lights, you can buy cheap spiral compact florescents in clip on reflectors. A 100 watt equilvlent bulb in the right spectrum would do just fine for lights, and would only cost about 15$. It would grow macros just fine and is cheaper than most things you could get.
The only thing to worry about is agression. You cant keep more than 1 pair or trio maybe per tank. You could get all 6 and return the ones that dont pair up. Thats a good way to get a mated pair. Just keep taking out any that get picked on and you will eventually get a breeding pair. I have a good book that you will want to pick up if you are seriously considering this. Its called “The Complete Illustrated Breeders Guide to Marine Aquarium Fishes”. It is definatley worth the money, and it goes into specific species information for most commonly bred species.
Hey, Glad to hear some interest in breeding Banggai Cardinals. Like Al mentioned, i had a breeding pair about 6 -7 years ago. I bought bought one, and liked it so much i bought another some time later. wasn’t sure if i had a pair. they were in my 75 community mixed reef tank. they were less than a year old when i got them. the ones you see in stores are about 8-9 months old. at a year they can spawn. My pair sorta hung out together, but, i wasnt thinking of breeding then. I though i would add a third BC and see what happened. well one of my first fish started chasing the newbie and biting off fins. the other sat in a corner and watch. the two males were sparring. so i took the new fish back to the store . a few months later i noticed one had the mumps and wasn’t eating. that was dad with a mouth full of pink eggs. like little salmon eggs. so i had a pair, and they started spawning.
Dad holds the eggs about 20-24 days, he doen’t eat at all. just finds a quiet slow flow spot and hangs out. around 20 days the eggs hatch but the fry stay in his mouth, probably eating the egg casings, and anything that floats in. he lolds them a couple days till they are good to go. then at night after lights out let them go. I had to catch them with a turkey baster and move them to a rearing tank. they will go to the bottom sand bed and are attracted to a small flash light. hatch size was anywhere between 12 -36 for me. you can’t leave them with the parents. there is no parenting. i watched dad spit one out only to se mom swoop down and eat it. and as soon as the last one is released, dad is ready to eat too. so you you have to stay up and catch them.
If you have a small tank where you can catch dad around hatch day, you can put him in a tank with an egg crate floor on pvc legs so that the fry can swim down through the crate and be safe. a small light below will attract them. then put dad back with mom . then feed him like crazy until they do it again. usually about a week.
You will need a constant supply of fresh hatched artemia. i ran two of those 2 liter bottle hatchers, staggered. they need to eat like every couple hours. they ate the live artemia for about 6-8 weeks before
they would even look at any other type food. like decapsulated artemia cysts. It seems i had to keep each hatch in their own tank. so you need a bunch of 2 1/2. 5 and 10 gallon tanks for rearing. the newly hatched fry i could keep in one of those little hang on tank plastic fish breeders, about 5 x 3 x4 inches? with small holes and slots for water flow, and just hang it in the tank with the previous hatch. BS they didnt eat swam out for the older fish. I just put a couple little plastic plants in the breeder for them to hang around in/ small world.
mine kept spawning every 4-5 weeks for two years till hurricane Issabel crashed my tanks with a 5 day power outage. that about covers it. I miss them. might get more some day. glad to help with any other info you might need. these fish are only found in a real small local area that is getting fished out. they dont migrate from island to island. which is why captive breeding of them is very important.
Thanks to everyone for the informative help. I have ordered “The Complete Illustrated Breeders Guide to Marine Aquarium Fishes” and watched a few videos of spawning banggai on YouTube. Very very different from my freshwater mouthbrooders. I currently breed Betta macrostoma . . . they spawn with an embrace and the eggs “rain down” after which they are collected by both parents and eventually transferred to the male . . . the banggai are more like “honey, can you hold my purse for a minute?”. I am definately taking my time getting ready for this. In the next few days I am getting the setup together and will probably bug the guy across the street for some seeded sand. I just remembered he has like a 180G saltwater, just haven’t seen him in a while.
cheers,
wm_crash, the friendly hooligan
[quote=“wm_crash, post:9, topic:1457”]
In the next few days I am getting the setup together and will probably bug the guy across the street for some seeded sand. I just remembered he has like a 180G saltwater, just haven’t seen him in a while.[/quote]
Let him know about this site.