i just got a 165g acrylic with two internal overflows, and a huge wet dry. what size pump do i need to run this setup and what brand ‘s’ should i get?
first off do you know what the rating is on the 2 overflows? i would guess around 600 gph each. i am a big fan of mag pumps for internal sump usage. i would use a mag if setting it in sump
it is going into the sump. im not sure of the size, i got tank and sump off ebay and the guy didnt know much about it. he had someone set it up for him. is there a way i can tell ?
Pondmaster mag-drive pumps are fantastic, i would use at least a mag-drive 12.
Important piece of information is how much “head” will it have (how far from the pump to the return nozzles vertically do you have?) every inch reduces the velocity of the water.
not sure yet, i have to build a stand. can you have too big of a pump? or too small?
fish-welcome
yes and yes but better to have too big. your drain is simple enough to determine, its based on the diameter of the drain pipe. chances are they are between 1"-1.5" with 1" being most likely for dual overflows.
+1 on the Mag pumps. Probably the best choice for in-sump set-ups. If you use soft plumbing instead of PVC pipe to connect the output a little trick is to hang the pump from the plumbing so that it does not touch the bottom of the sump. this will reduce the noise caused by vibration a LOT.
You can easily have too big or too small of a sump. Too big and your tank will overflow.(by that I don’t mean in the boxes, but over the entire top rim and onto your floor) Too small and you won’t get proper surface skimming and will end up with scum floating on top of your tank.
First off check to see how large the holes are in the tank and how many there are in each overflow box. Secondly decide if you like to go external or internal with the sump. I would recommend internal typically in smaller systems and for newer hobbyist, but I would say this is a large tank.
Short answer a mag 12 probably be ok. Is this going to be a full reef tank or are you just going with fish and live rock?
on each overflow there is a 2" bulkhead and a 1 1/2" hole.the guy gave me his cut up pvc and it looks like he had 2" drains then after 2’ converted to 1 1/2". 3/4 in the return. id like to just start over .
im thinking reef. ive had fish and rock years ago, time to step up!
he probably reduced the size to reduce noise. 2" drains are HUGE for a tank that small. i only have 1" drains on my 265g.
their isnt an exact number for the amount of turnover you want through your overflows. if the pump is too big you can either dial it back or divert it. if its too small you can only take it back to the store so better bigger than smaller. a bigger pump will also allow you to add a manifold down the road if you decide to add any equipment(reactors, frag tank, remote filtration, etc) without having to upgrade your pump.
if you can go external i would. you can get a panworld external pump rated rated at the same gph thats more efficient, much more quiet, and just nicer overall for only about $30-$40 more.
I like to go by the numbers. Marine Depot always has good pump performance charts to work with. the Mag 12 uses 110 watts and at 3-4 foot head delivers about 1100 GPH from a sump to tank, about 3 1/2 foot head. I’ve run a mag 7 on my 75 for 11 years now. only had to replace the impeller once. for submersible pumps:
http://www.marinedepot.com/ps_ViewItem.aspx?category=Danner_Mag_Drive_Supreme_Water_Pump_Up_to_500_Gallons_Per_Hour_Submersible_Water_Pumps&vendor=Danner_Mfg.&idProduct=DN1111&IdCategory=FIWPSBUF&child=DN1129&tab=1&size=12%20(1200%20gph)
all their pumps. the smaller hyper pump works on 120 watts. and higher output, if your overflows can handle it.
http://155.212.86.141/infoS.asp#
and
i use a couple Quiet one 3000s for two 40 gallon frag tanks. low watts. work good. a quiet one 4000 or 6000 might work.
Submersible Pumps - Bulk Reef Supply
http://www.lifegardaquatics.com/products/product.php?id=10
and for external dry pumps there is a wide variety. they use more watts but are durable. I like submersible. less leaks on the floor.
Figure out what the overflow max rate is and then choose a pump. if they are 1 1/2 inch dual durso overflows, it can easily handle the 1200 gph. but as overflows age, they clog with
marine growth, their flow rate will goe down. more friction and restriction.
they use more watts but are durablenot necessarily true. Reeflo pumps can be twice as efficient as submersible Mags and the panworld i recommended is more efficient as well. the efficiency is often related to the maximum head. the bigger the head the less efficient generally.
Quiet one 3000s for two 40 gallon frag tanks. low watts. work good. a quiet one 4000 or 6000 might work.+1 i had always thought of these as "cheapie" pumps but have had one on my 75g turtle tank for a couple of years with no problems. and that tank is NASTY!!!
but as overflows age, they clog with marine growth, their flow rate will goe down. more friction and restriction.great point. same with pumps. everytime i break down a pump and clean it the difference is always very noticeable.
Oh Oh!
I’m a little behind the times. that new reeflo pump you mention does do a whole lot more flow on 108 watts. great for a closed loop. not sure the 165 tanks overflows coud handle it for a return pump.
Bulk Reef Supply - Search Results for ps ViewItem aspx IdCategory FIWPEPOH category ReeFlo External Pump 2000 Gallons Per Hour Higher External Water Pumps child MM1124 idProduct MM1124 size Snapper 20 282500 20gph 29 tab 1 vendor Reeflo
sweet pump!
thnx for the info…ill get some pics up soon and as i build. nice to meet yous
I have been using that Reeflo pump on my 180 for years now, very quiet for external pump. Another point about using an external pump is that it will not contribute any heat to your overall temp.
it will not contribute any heat to your overall temp
ok, now i just feel like a d$%k BUT, external pumps can contribute just as much heat as internal pumps. the effect has less to do with a pump being internal/external and more to do with the size of the pump and overall power consumption vs efficiency. there are external pumps that are notorious for adding as much 2-3 degrees to the overall temp!!
the reeflo pumps are simply in a league of their own but unfortunately are overkill for most hobbyists. one of the more unique features about their pumps is not only will restricting the output not hurt the pump but it will actually reduce overall power consumption and consequently possibly extend the life of the pump! i use a panworld for my return but have the reeflo orca as my skimmer pump which is a gold(balder) DART pump with a needle wheel prop. super nasty!!
My reply was not intended to cause anyone to think that I was trying to make someone look bad. It is just my opinion about the use of external pumps. It should have read …it will contribute less heat to your overall temp.
Here is an piece I found from Steven Pro about external pumps. It is titled " External pump Impressions"
By Steven Pro
With the increasing popularity of sump-based systems and closed loop circulation, a thorough discussion of external water pumps is warranted. External pumps have several pluses in comparison to internal ones. External pumps usually impart significantly less heat than internal pumps. This can be extremely important for reef systems with their high intensity, high heat lighting systems. Plus, many are more powerful than internal pump options. As such, most larger aquaria are designed to incorporate at least one and sometimes numerous externally mounted pumps to provide the majority of the displays circulation.
no worries John! ;D
i just know there are some external pumps that are notorious for causing heat issues which i would guess have more to do with design flaws than anything else. i just didnt want anyone to get the impression that thermal issues could be determine by this alone. the good thing is that both external pumps recommended in this thread are known for having minimum impact on system temps!!
one thing that would be interesting to see is if a mag pump, which can be run in/out of sump, contributes significantly more heat when plumbed internal than external.
None taken :BEER
Further into the article:
E.G. Danner/Supreme Mag-Drives:
While a lot of people know that these pumps can be used submerged, they also can be mounted as an external pump. I have used a number of these pumps in this manner and have found them to function just fine. They are very reliable, but their strongest selling point is how inexpensive they are. They are one of the cheapest pumps available! They do have their downsides though. They are not the quietest pump. And, they likely impart more heat to the water than other external pumps. Still considering their price and reliability, they are an attractive choice.
The only other potential problem people have with these pumps is salt creep. They are prone to tiny leaks, resulting in some salt residue around the intersection of the pump housing to the impeller cover if the o-ring is not seated in place properly. This can usually be corrected easily enough by unscrewing the four screws holding the impeller cover in place and reinstalling the o-ring. Otherwise, maintenance is rather minimal on these pumps.
Here is the link to the entire piece
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_3/cav3i2/External_Pumps/External_Pumps.htm
may also use a piece of soft rubber to rest them on in the sump to help with vibration.