Tank: 55gallon
Lighting: stock lighting for right now until DPA gets the new shipment in adding a t5 fixture
Skimmer: none right now will add one soon currently running carbon whisper for the next week
Powerhead: aqua clear 50 and 1 koralia 3
Heater: marineland 250 watt
Rock: Started with 34lbs of base rock, and about 7lbs of figi rock 3.5lbs tonga branch.
Sand: 80lbs of Carib Sea Argonite
so this is my second foray into the saltwater hobby initially had a tank while growing up i plan on eventually adding some corals but for the most part it will be FO considering this tank will be moved next june
this is a before pick the tank housed a large mouth bass and a channel catfish( was goign for a “creek tank”)
added the sand and rock can barely see it tho gotta let the dust settle and i even washed the sand before hand
all the left over bottles you should have seen the check out lady when i pulled up with 2 carts full of distilled h2o
thats all for now goign to let the tank settle for a day or so and make sure the salinty is good before i add some damesels yes i know they are extremely hard to take out!
I’ve seen that look from the check out lady with 2 carts of distilled water. Actually think I did three carts one time when I was filling my 75g, lol. Though if you look at it 75 gallons of water * $0.70 is about 25% the cost of an RO unit. I’m sure in the past I bought enough RO water to equal the cost of an RO unit or two, lol.
Why add the damsels when you could add table shrimp to help cycle the tank? In my opinion it’s pointless, destructive, and actually more expensive, but that’s just one opinion.(though many would agree with me)
[quote=“Gordonious, post:2, topic:1193”]
I’ve seen that look from the check out lady with 2 carts of distilled water. Actually think I did three carts one time when I was filling my 75g, lol. Though if you look at it 75 gallons of water * $0.70 is about 25% the cost of an RO unit. I’m sure in the past I bought enough RO water to equal the cost of an RO unit or two, lol.
Why add the damsels when you could add table shrimp to help cycle the tank? In my opinion it’s pointless, destructive, and actually more expensive, but that’s just one opinion.(though many would agree with me) [/quote]
well i plan on keeping them in the tank for the most part …its going to get hot in my apt over summer no central air and i don’t want to risk anything pricey on temp swings chiller is probably out of the question right now considering i plan to keep this sumpless and they are kinda expensive
The $6 chiller from the discount stores. a clip on fan.
[quote=“kaptken, post:4, topic:1193”]
The $6 chiller from the discount stores. a clip on fan.
[/quote]
i’ve seen those applied to aquariums before but im still concerned with the temps from july-sept when we have those 90 degree days… i’ll have to experiment
waters starting to finally clear…should be going out and purchasing a skimmer/damsels today and possibly a little more live rock
Adding damsels before the tank has cycled will likely cause death if not extreme pain and discomfort to the fish. The ammonia as it spikes will burn their gills making it painful and sometimes impossible to breath.
That is a very old and outdated method of cycling a tank.
Gordonious tried to steer you in the right direction by suggesting you use a raw table shrimp as that is not the preferred and socially acceptable means to cycle a tank now.
I used the uncooked shrimp in my tank after doing A LOT of research. If you go to Acme, or Food Lion, you can buy the frozen jumbo shrimp for the same price as 2 or 3 damsels in most cases. You can put 1 jumbo shrimp in a 55 and easily start the cycle. (use the rest of the shrimp for dinner that night) After about 2 or 3 days of the shrimp sitting in there you take it out, don’t let it disintegrate into a bunch of little pieces or you could have an extended cycling period due to the rotting flesh (or so I have heard).
My recommendation would be to get the frozen jumbo shrimp, rubber band it to a piece of rubble rock (dead or alive). Let it sit for a few days and pull the whole thing out and discard it. The left over rotting flesh from the jumbo shrimp will start the nitrification process very quickly. This is a much better and faster way to get this process started.
Using fish or stock of any kind is pretty cruel if the nitrification process hasn’t even started yet. I hope this doesn’t come across as ignorant, but in the end, you are doing the same with the damsels as you would with jumbo shrimp, because when your damsels die (which is a very high probability, regardless of how hardy they are) you can just leave them in there for a few days and let them begin to rot. You should probably do some research into what the fish go through based on what ammonia and nitrites in saltwater will do to them. It sounded very painful to me.
verdict_in
Why not just save some time, fish stress, increased chance for disease in the water, and possibly even some money, and get the shrimp. ;D
Now, I am very new to the hobby, but I have learned one thing, you will hear 100 different ways to do everything in this tank, some are good suggestions, some are bad suggestions. In the end, it is your tank, and you have to decide how you want to do things.
thanks for the opinions everyone … i’m aware of all the controversy and im also well versed in the nutrient cycles/chemistry…i’ve added the damsels with sand from a friends tank today and more live rock…i will watch for the ammonia spike then i plan changing 20% of the water if that alleviates any ethical concerns
I believe doing any sort of water change in the middle of the cycling could negate the cycle. Everything I read said not to do a water change until the nitrites hit zero.
The nicest thing with using the uncooked shrimp is the fact that the creation of ammonia is almost immediate (meaning days). Where when trying to cycle with fish the ammonia spike may take up to a couple of weeks to really happen because the bio load is not big enough. When adding a shrimp, with the warm water and the light, the bio load is almost immediate. It has been talked about over and over again about being the fastest way to cycle a tank, let alone the cheapest. Regardless, good luck, and I hope your damsels do ok and make it through the cycle without any issues.
[quote=“ihuntinde, post:10, topic:1193”]
I believe doing any sort of water change in the middle of the cycling could negate the cycle. Everything I read said not to do a water change until the nitrites hit zero. [/quote]
i actually thought changing the water would inhibit the cycling as well until i read this article
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2009-04/newbie/index.php
I stand corrected.
Personally, I would still wonder what a water change would do, in a fresh cycling tank. I would think that it would dilute the food source that some of that bacteria is in need of in order to continue to thrive and “breed” or multiply. But there are much smarter people out there than me, that know a lot more. I am just using what seems to be common sense, which isn’t always right in this hobby. 
[quote=“ihuntinde, post:12, topic:1193”]
I stand corrected.
Personally, I would still wonder what a water change would do, in a fresh cycling tank. I would think that it would dilute the food source that some of that bacteria is in need of in order to continue to thrive and “breed” or multiply. But there are much smarter people out there than me, that know a lot more. I am just using what seems to be common sense, which isn’t always right in this hobby. :)[/quote]
i think its a general consensus that everyone is constantly learning in this hobby especially with all the innovations which constantly come out…but the bacteria for the most part is benthic and contained within the porous live rock itself
[quote=“andrewk529, post:9, topic:1193”]
i will watch for the ammonia spike then i plan changing 20% of the water if that alleviates any ethical concerns[/quote]
It doesn’t. What you’re doing is intentionally harming an animal. To put an animal in an environment that will result in burned lungs is the equivelant of being locked in a room full of mustard gas. To know this and still do it is just mean.
[quote=“Cdangel0, post:14, topic:1193”]
[quote=“andrewk529, post:9, topic:1193”]
i will watch for the ammonia spike then i plan changing 20% of the water if that alleviates any ethical concerns[/quote]
It doesn’t. What you’re doing is intentionally harming an animal. To put an animal in an environment that will result in burned lungs is the equivelant of being locked in a room full of mustard gas. To know this and still do it is just mean.[/quote]
i highly doubt exposing them to a non-lethal amount of NH3 is tantamount to locking an animal in a room with an inveserating agent not to mention the neurophysiology of fish and pain is debatable but thats another subject you can’t always anthropomorphize situations
[quote=“andrewk529, post:15, topic:1193”]
i highly doubt exposing them to a non-lethal amount of NH3[/quote]
But it is often lethal - which is a problem in and of itself.
Just seems pointless to use live fish when a raw table shrimp works more effectively and humanely.
[quote=“Cdangel0, post:16, topic:1193”]
[quote=“andrewk529, post:15, topic:1193”]
i highly doubt exposing them to a non-lethal amount of NH3[/quote]
But it is often lethal - which is a problem in and of itself.
Just seems pointless to use live fish when a raw table shrimp works more effectively and humanely.[/quote]
i think we both make relevant points but honestly i’d rather not stare at an empty tank when given my previous experiences not losing a single damsel during cycling i opted for this method…when i was growing up i cared for a saltwater aquarium full of damsels for 2 years without all of the fancy filtration we have today and i think it comes down to good maintenance in both situations
happy damsels Saint:)
no one claimed they WOULDNT be happy, for awhile at least. >LOCO<
Good maintenance isn’t the issue. Good husbandry is.
We, as a club, strive to educate, preserve, and protect. Adding fish to a non-cycled tank just so you have something to look at 2 weeks sooner slaps the club, the hobby, and it’s principles in the face.
I’m glad you were successful when you were younger, please understand that science and research have come a long way in the last 10 years and many of the old principles we used are no longer valid or acceptable. I wish you the best of luck, but if you choose to ignore the experts or even those of us that have been in the hobby for many years then that is on you, I am sure you will understand if we don’t all come running with answers when you have questions if you refuse to take our advice and do what you want anyway.
[quote=“Cdangel0, post:19, topic:1193”]
I’m glad you were successful when you were younger, please understand that science and research have come a long way in the last 10 years and many of the old principles we used are no longer valid or acceptable. I wish you the best of luck, but if you choose to ignore the experts or even those of us that have been in the hobby for many years then that is on you, I am sure you will understand if we don’t all come running with answers when you have questions if you refuse to take our advice and do what you want anyway.[/quote]
point taken…guess i’ll consult the morris library if i have any further questions…but these fish will be fine irregardless of what you percieve as poor husbandry nor am i attempting to get into a science lesson on fish physiology…these species of damsels have developed a system to adapt to higher concentrations of NH3 which they won’t even be expirencing in my tank ( ie water changes) i wasn’t attempting to offend anyone with my posts or methods just was excited and wanted to share my build